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Archive for August, 2010

Pseudo-Hanbali admits Imam Tabari believed in creation of place, yet persists!

Posted by muhammedm on August 22, 2010

أبدأُ بالحمدِ مُصَلِّياً على مُحمَّدٍ خَيِر نبيْ أُرســـــِلا

Initially, I didn’t want to discuss this issue further due to the many quotes by Hanbali scholars, but because of the continuation of the individual in defending ascription of makan to Allah ta’ala, I feel that exposing this individual is necessary. After reading many of his posts, the individual is hell-bent on refuting anything that the AhlusSunnah Mutakallimun hold, this topic being one of them, not only does he continue to go down the road of ‘refuting negation of makan’, but he says that some of the early Salaf ascribed makan to Him.
This post is regarding his explicit statements in which he says that at one point ‘makan’ wasn’t there, but came into being, thus it (makan) being a creation. In the links below he says: “The most that can be deduced from all of this is that Allah was present when there was no place.” This is an explicit statement from him saying Imam Tabari’s quote means that there was NO PLACE when Allah ta’ala was present in pre-eternity. Now if he wants to continue with his stubborn rant about ascribing place to Him, then that would mean that He is in creation, as he himself has said at one time or another there was not place, hence it’s a creation.
In the second quote he says: “when in fact he was clearly referring to pre-creation. Why did you say ‘is’, which denotes the present tense, when in fact the Khalifah was talking about pre-creation when nothing had been created, including place? Why didn’t you say ‘was’?” This quote is explicit that the psuedo-hanbali believes makan to be a creation, yet he continues to argue that it’s wrong to negate it and it’s fine to say He is in makan, as his quote “Why didn’t you say ‘was’? implies since he’s arguing that it’s fine to say makan is created, yet it’s ok to say He’s in place now, and we seek refuge in Allah ta’ala from such beliefs.

Allah ta’ala indwelling in creation is the belief of the misguided sufis and other sects, May Allah ta’ala protect us from such deviancy.

Links – 1st quote – http://forums.islamicawakening.com/f15/allah-exists-without-place-refuted-22759/index2.html#post217472
2nd quote – http://forums.islamicawakening.com/f15/quotes-salafi-scholars-23142/index3.html#post221370

Wa ‘alaykumus Salam

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